Saturday, August 25, 2018

VGC 19 Moon and Sun Series

Moon and Sun Series: 

Keep in mind that everything below is for Sun, but will be updating it for Moon. The likely changes from Sun to Moon seem to be:

1. Mons in general, especially Groudon being worse defensively, but better offensively (because Z Water Spout OHKOs it) because of Z moves.
2. Mons that don't usually OHKO things but can with a Z move and have high speed will be good candidates for Z moves, such as Koko or Kartana.
3. Mons that have high-powered Z moves like Kyogre's Spout or mons with Eruption will have more offensive options. However a weather boost is unreliable for a Z move and Kyogre seems more ideal for Spout since the Z move is resisted a lot or may face Sun and doesn't do enough damage through resistances at times.
4. Knock Off will be significantly worse as Z items will reduce damage and keep the item. Maybe use Foul play instead. Berries will become better since Knock Off will be rarer.
5. Mons that have been really good defensively like AV Yveltal may have to be used with a different item or used differently in general.
6. LightningRod will be more common as I expect Koko to use the Z move a lot more often.
7. 2 or more Z moves may be fine, but you probably should use only 1 if a Restricted holds one.
8. Try to put Z items on nonrestricted slots to allow for more flexibility, but make sure they are picked often.
9. Special Z move users tend to be better than physical ones as Intimidate does not reduce damage.
10. Mons with low accuracy like Groudon/Ferrothorn/Tsareena will benefit from a Z item.
11. Z items in combination with Beast Boost can be really useful for momentum.
12. Z moves + powering up Terrain is helpful.
13. Z items being on a mon that takes a lot from Knock Off, like Lunala, are good.
14. Protect and Sash becomes worse from Z moves hitting through.
15. Stalling becomes worse and speed control becomes better.
16. Mons with 4x weaks or even 2x weaks take decent damage through Protect from a Z move.
17. Z moves getting an Aura Boost are powerful.

Good Restricted Combos for Moon:

1. Ground Z Groudon Yveltal (Mudhiman's type of team except maybe change the Venusaur slot)
2. Water Z Kyogre Yveltal Lightningrod (Prefer Togedemaru)
3. Xern Ogre
4. Xern Groudon
5. XY if the Fairy weakness isn't too much for you.


These are all the good combos I believe as Lunala is too weak to Yveltal, but still high-tier and some combos like XY or dual weather just don't mix.

Moon Sample Teams:

1. Lunala Ogre https://pokepast.es/6886d0a5c383f0a2
2. Groudon Yveltal https://pokepast.es/26bad1d2d35df257

The above two teams are very similar to what was used in Anaheim for 1st and 2nd place finishers. On the 2nd team can also replace Scrafty with Poisonium Z Venusaur and Electricium Z Koko with Agauv Groudon and possibly AV Yveltal.

See my Anaheim Regs Warstory of how I got 2nd place in 2018 and feel free to steal my team!

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/my-vgc-warstory-at-anaheim-regs-2018.3645126/


Teambuilding Guide:

1. Sleep Counter: Koko/Fini/Faster than Smeargle Taunt/Two Grass Types/etc.
2. Weather Counter: Kyogre/Groudon/T-tar/Abomasnow/Manual Weather/Dry Skin/etc.
3. Two Restricted
4. Xerneas Counter: Steel Type(Ferro/DM Necrozma/Staka)/PoisonType (Crobat), Haze, etc.
5. Kyogre Counter: Ludicolo/Groudon/Wide Guard/Dry Skin/AV Koko/Kartana/Xern, etc.
6. Trick Room/Tailwind/Geomancy/etc. + < 85 speed mon for TR (Speed Control)
7. Intimidate: Incineroar, etc.
8. Redirection Counter: Sky Drop/S. Goggles/Grasses/Spread Moves/etc. go thru Amoonguss
9. One or more Z moves (Moon and Ultra Series)

Use Pyrotoz.com/https://richi3f.github.io/pokemon-team-planner/ for the rest

Mons for me to test out:

1. Kommo-O
2. Rotom-Mow

High Tier (NOT ranked from Best to Worst:

Restricted:

Groudon - ZA
Xerneas
Yveltal - ZAu

Non-Restricted:

Incineroar
Kartana - ZT
Koko - ZAuTS
Lele - ZAuTS
Lando-T - Z
Stakataka
Tornadus - ZAS, needs Z move to be High Tier and be on an Ogre Team
Toxicroak - Z
Venusaur - ZTS

Almost High Tier:

Amoonguss - I used it in a MSS and got 2nd place, shoulda won the whole tourney, but I found that it couldn't be picked well vs Fini or Koko teams and too many grass mons like Venusaur hit through Rage Powder so it wasn't very useful except at countering Trick Room.
Kyogre - ZWS, needs Rain and Speed Ctrl at all times, maybe high tier with Rain Dance
Ludicolo - ZWATS - Lacks Consistent Power and is OHKO'd easily
Lunala - ZS - Yveltal Weak
Fini - ZWAuS, - Normally outclassed by Koko and misses its moves
Togedemaru - ZT
Tsareena - Its moves miss a lot.
Victreebel - ZTS - Outsped by Venusaur, bad outside of Sun. Not hard enough neutral dmg.
Volcarona - Niche mon, but beats Groudon Yveltal and a few others. Watch out though for Rain or Rock Slide, Tornadus.

Almost any combo of these seems to work. But Groudon Ogre needs too much speed control and Yveltal Xern makes Fairy moves kill your own Yveltal.


Z = Good with or without a Z move
W = Weather Boost (Fire/Water Z move), but can also be a liability at times offensively.
A = Accuracy Boost with Z move (Such as Pblades being a main move)
Au = Aura like Fairy or Dark Boost
T = Terrain Boost (Grassy/Psychic/Electric) is mostly relevant if you combine it with the right Tapu
S = Special
ZWAAuTS = Z + W + A + Au + T + S, same with other acronyms but in a different order or only part of these

* = Mons that are high tier, but not common

All of these boosts do not have to be generated by the same Pokemon. For example Xern + Lele makes Lele have a stronger Fairy Type Z move. If you have for example Moonblast as a common move on for example Lele then it counts. Same goes for weather, aura, and other terrain boosts. And even though some mons like Koko may get both Dazzling Gleam and Tbolt, there can only be one terrain at a time so there is only one boost, that is why it isn't double "Au."

See this guide and my comment on it to learn who are ideal Z move users more in-depth:

https://www.nimbasacitypost.com/2019/01/a-preview-of-z-moves-in-vgc-2019-moon.html?showComment=1546588351303#c1352812821333740940


Common Tierless Pokemon: 

All the Restricteds +

Amoonguss*
Bronzong*
Clefairy*
Crobat*
Fini
Incineroar
Ferrothorn*
Gengar*
Kartana
Koko
Lele
Ludicolo*
Raichu*
Smeargle*
Stakataka
Togedemaru
Tornadus
Toxicroak
Tsareena*
Venusaur

PS: The usage is important for teambuilding even though it is not a tier.
* = Mons that are common but aren't high tier or I am not sure about.


Some common combos:

1. Yveltal + Incineroar: Dark Aura helps Incineroar and this is similar to when I and others used Kang Yveltal in 16 in the sense that Kang's dark move (Sucker Punch) was boosted. Fake out support + Knock Off having extra power.
      Counters: Yveltal is countered by Rock, Fairy, Ice, and Electric moves. Koko, Lele's terrain, Spore, Weavile, Raichu, Xerneas, Fini, Dark Resists
2. Ludicolo Kyogre: This is a classic lead from the beginning of time. Swift Swim + Scarf Ogre is common again.
      Counters: Ferrothorn, Toxicroak, Amoonguss, Trick Room, Wide Guard, Lele + Scarf mon, Sun, AV Koko
3. Smeargle Xerneas: Follow Me, Fake Out, Spore, Spiky Shield Smeargle usually playing a supporting role in helping Xerneas set up.
      Counters: Ferrothorn, Amoonguss, Misty/Electric Terrain, Steel or Poison or Fire Types, Red Card*, Ditto, Trick Room, Roar Incineroar, Whirlwind, Fake Out, Snarl, Clear Smog, Haze*, Spore*, Grass Types, Safety Goggles, Lum, Safeguard, Kartana, Sub, Staka*, Psych Up, Psystrike, Psyshock, Taunt, Magic Room, Faster Knock Off
4. Incineroar Dialga: Fake Out support for Trick Room
5. Incineroar Xerneas: Fake Out and Intimidate Support + Geomancy + Roar
        Counters: Taunt Lele, Lele + Lunala,Scarf Ogre + something like Xern or Lele, Tailwind, TR, Psych Up, Follow Me, Rage Powder, Psystrike, Psyshock, Steel or Poison or Fire Types, Red Card*, Ditto, , Roar Incineroar, Whirlwind, Fake Out, Snarl, Clear Smog, Haze*, Spore*, Staka*, Tsareena, pokemon that OHKO Incineroar (Scarf Ogre for ex or WH Groudon), faster Roarer/Whirlwinder, Encore their Fake Out if used T1, Taunt, Quick Guard, Magic Room, Faster Knock Off, Z moves that super affect like: Steelium Z Kart*/Durant, Poisonium Z or Life Orb Naganadel/Nihilego/Gengar, Firium Z Zard/Volc/Blace if Sun up, Salazzle, Volcarona,
6. Lunala Xern: Offensive support for Steels like Dusk Mane and immune to Fake Out while Xern sets up
       Counters: Yveltal, Dark types in general, chip damage, phazing moves, special seed, spore, Magic Room, Faster Knock Off
7. Groudon Venusaur
       Counters: Incineroar, Misty/Electric Terrain, Kyogre switching in or slower one, Safety Goggles, Prankster Taunt, Tornadus, Yveltal (if no sleep powder), Wide Guard, Lunala Koko Combo with Natures Madness MGB, Lum, Hail/Sand, letting something die then switching in a counter mon like Ogre, Fast Grass type like Kartana, Amoonguss, Zygarde Fini
8. Groudon Incineroar
9. Groudon Yveltal: Ice Moves, Intimidate, manual Rain Dance, Strong Physical Moves, Toxic, Foul Play, Z moves like Lele's Fairium Z, Blizzard, Wide Guard, Guzzlord, few ground weaks, Misty/Electric Terrain, not too many flying mons vs Sleep Powder, a well-positioned Xern or Ogre, Flare Blitz, Lele, Sleep vs Yveltal, Blissey with physical seed, Specs Zard with Solar Power, Zapdos with slow Roost and Toxic.
10. Groudon Xern
11. Kyogre Yveltal
12. Kyogre Xern
13. Yveltal Xern
14. Dusk Mane Ogre
15. Dialga Ogre
16. Zygarde Fini
17. Koko Kartana
18. Yveltal Koko
19. Tornadus Ogre
20. Tornadus Kart
21. Tornadus Incineroar
22. Tornadus Amoonguss
23. Tornadus Xern
24. Xern Kart
25. Gengar Ogre
26. Xern Ogre
27. Xern Amoonguss
28. Ogre Kart
29. Ogre Incineroar
30. Ogre Amoonguss
31.
32. Kart Incineroar
33. Kart Amoonguss
34. Incineroar Amoonguss
35. Lunala Bat
36. Lunala Croak
37. Lunala Incin
38. Lunala Smeargle
39. Xern Bat
40. Xern Croak
41. Bat Croak
42. Bat Incin
43. Bat Smeargle
44. Croak Incin
45. Croak Smeargle
46. Incin Smeargle
47. Lunala Koko
48. Lunala Ogre
49. Lunala Lele
50. Lunala Kart
51. Koko Incin
52. Koko Ogre
53. Koko Lele
54. Koko Kart
55. Incin Lele
56. Ogre Lele
57. Lele Kart

Medium Tier:

Restricteds:

1. Dialga - Has overall weaker defensive typing than Lunala (Groudon, Croak, etc)
2. Dusk-Mane Necrozma - It gets walled too easily and people just Intimidate spam it with Incineroar. You can switch but overall it has too many resistances to it and the good items on it are lost when you switch (psychic seed or weakness policy). But more importantly Z moves make TR worse in general and being weak to Foul Play/Yveltal + Lunala and Incineroar is too hard to make work.
3. Solgaleo - weak defensively and few resists (Dedicated Xern Counter), use Staka instead
4. Kyurem-Black - Power Herb or Icium Z, but can only use Freeze Shock one time after that no good Ice move. Has good offensive and defensive typing except vs Xerneas, Solgaleo, or DM. Use another Ice type that isn't a restricted slot.
4. Ho-Oh - It does pretty well in general with good typing, but there is a lot of Rain and is 4x weak to Rock Slide.
5. Zygarde all forms - Doesn't do much damage, 4x weak to ice, but has potential with Coil and Swagger Fini

Nonrestricteds:

1. Ninetales-Drought - Outclassed normally by Groudon and Incineroar and Xern wall it as well as Rain , ZWAS.
3.  Tyranitar - Brings in Sand and is decent offensively. Recommend using on a Yveltal team. Overall though it doesn't hit hard enough unless it super affects something and has many weaknesses. Works well vs Yveltal teams.
4. Pelipper - No power and 4 move syndrome. Needs more than just Hurricane to have good offensive coverage (Scald), but also needs Wide Guard and Tailwind and Protect. Also there is no point of it since you can use Kyogre instead and Ogre doesn't need a 2nd Drizzler. Pelipper providing rain is good though for Ludicolo, Steels, etc.
5. Parasect - Has Dry Skin which is very important and the potential to wide guard.
6. Pheromosa - Too fragile, gets ohko'd easily but can't use Sash since it needs the power. Need to use late game and position well, but can't switch in on anything almost.
7. Persian - Recommend Roseli, but Sash or Mago is good also. Lele kinda makes Persian not so great plus the fact its main offensive move is Foul Play.
8. Blissey - Psychic Seed Blissey is good for setting up, but does not work vs Leech Seed with multiple opposing mons alive as they can switch in and out or the various other moves that beat Blissey or random luck over many turns.
9. Scrafty - Normally outclassed by Incin, but has different typing and can be a 2nd Intimidater.
10. Metagross - Has some weaks and isn't offensive or supportive enough. Also slow.
11. Swampert - has good typing and Wide Guard, but does not do a lot of damage unless it super affects something and is slow.
12. Bisharp - OHKO'd  by Xern and gets OHKO'd a lot in general. Still good with Yveltal though.
13. Hitmontop - Weak to Psychic and Tornadus which are both very common right now and doesn't do much in Psychic Terrain. Also weak to Fairy.
14. Salazzle - Fast and Powerful with Support moves, but dies too easily and doesn't do enough in Rain.
15. Qwilfish - Counters Ludicolo Kyogre and a decent amount of common mons, but gets killed too easily and relies on Rain a lot.
16. Politoed - Being used mostly just for rain and only having one good offensive move and some support makes it very hard to argue it is high tier. Typically Kyogre is used for this kind of role and rain is useless or may help out a lot of teams sometimes such as ones with Ludicolo.
17. Talonflame - Niche is outspeeding and countering Tornadus, Kartana, etc. It also is pretty offensive and accurate, but lacks a priority tailwind after it takes damage and sash doesn't make much sense on it. Tornadus is probably better if you want to use Talon mostly for speed control. Talonflame is countered by Psychic Terrain, has low power, and Gale Wings got nerfed.
18. Venusaur - niche is outspeeding scarfers in sun and being more powerful than timid Vileplume to outspeed scarfers
19. Vileplume - niche is being slower but outspeeding non scarfers in sun, more powerful than Venusaur but slower
20. Infernape - About the same tier as Salazzle and similar
21. Ferrothorn - Power Whip misses and seed bomb isn't powerful enough, plus fire is too common
22.  Raichu - Electric mons aren't on most teams and when they are they may not even pick Koko or use Dazzling Gleam or something. Raichu tends to suck unless it really uses its ability. Try Togedemaru instead.
23. Abomasnow - A lot of mons resist Ice now and it is 4x weak to Fire.
24. Ditto - Only good for Xern primarily and doesn't counter them if they don't Geomancy
25. Heatran - It needs a lot of support such as speed control and then it is like why would I pick it when I could pick a restricted mon instead? Not generally a great lead either since 4x weak to ground and other moves. Also weak in Rain.
26. Clefairy - Usually outclassed by Smeargle since it lacks Spore. Its niche is more bulk and Friend Guard.
27. Tornadus - Hurricane misses too much, but good supportive moves. High Tier if Z move.
28. Scizor - Incineroar OHKOs it in Rain, Groudon gives it problems as well as Psychic Terrain. A good Xern counter though and high powered priority move.
29. Blace - Good in general with its offensive coverage and Fake Out immunity, bluffs Scarf also. But it lacks supportive moves and doesn't ohko a lot unless it has a boost.
30. Volcarona - Could be great for supporting Xern or something, but it doesn't OHKO much and there are sometimes better supporting mons right now.
31. Torracat - Its only niche really over Arcanine and Incineroar is Taunt and having both Fake Out + Roar/Taunt. It is a dedicated very niche Xern counter, otherwise use Incineroar.
32. Jynx - It may have a niche of having FO + Lovely Kiss and high speed and decent power with Dry Skin. But it doesn't have follow me or the same typing as Smeargle. Most likely outclassed by Smeargle.
33. Bulu - It only has grass moves for the most part, and Superpower or Rock Slide. It doesn't OHKO much unless they are weak to it and has some nasty weaknesses. It does bring Terrain though.
34. Drampa (Cloud Nine) - Hard trick room teams don't work consistently from my experience and TR wears off too fast. It is also hard to get Drampa out with Ogre at the same time and if you do and they don't bring Groudon it weakens your water attack. Helping Hand can accomplish the same thing without a switchout except takes a move.
35. Lurantis - Relies too much on Intimidate to be good and even then it isn't very good. Too slow and isn't meant to counter anything besides Intimidate.
36. Thundurus - Decent for manual rain and attacking moves, but I just don't use it often enough.
37.
38. Oranguru - Good with Groudon and Gravity with Instruct and Inner Focus TR. But it cannot Gravity before its ally otherwise Instruct won't work right. And it is bad offensively not consistent enough also.
39. Gengar - Great movepool and Typing (Fake Out Immune and 2 great STABs), but weak offensively if you don't super affect and is fragile.
40. Crobat - Brave Bird isn't powerful enough with Intimidate and Super Fang misses too much.
41. Togekiss - Follow Me + Item and typing. Redirection centered teams aren't consistent especially with Xern.
42. Clefable - Follow Me + Unaware + Item. Redirection centered teams aren't consistent especially with Xern.
43. Smeargle - Redirection centered teams aren't consistent especially with Xern. Lovely Kiss can miss, so maybe use Spore.
44. Salamence - Very niche mon that does well vs Groudon Yveltal, otherwise there are better Intimidaters.
45. Vanilluxe - Niche mon, but beats Groudon Yveltal and a few other teams. Specs or Z move.
46. Guzzlord - Niche mon, but beats Groudon Yveltal and a few other teams. Wide Guard and Toxic.
47. Mamoswine - Niche mon, but beats Groudon Yveltal and a few other teams. Icium Z/Band
48.
49. Exeguttor and Exeguttor Alola - Z TR is good with Sleep Powder, but has not good enough defensive typing. Weak to Xern and Lele also to Koko.
50. Charizard - It is too hard to pick with all the Ogre, ZWAS. 

Low Tier:

Restricted:

1. Dawn Wings Necrozma - 4x weak to Dark, but still very powerful and good moves.
2. Giratina both forms - Too weak and Shadow Force alone breaking Protect is not redeeming enough. Also bad defensive typing.
3. Lugia - It does well with Calm Mind Roost and a physical Seed, but there are other ways to use it also. Anything that tries to set up though faces consistency issues.
4. Kyurem-W - Weak to too many attacks and lacks speed and offensive coverage
5. Mewtwo - Too many resists and it dies in one hit to a lot of moves
6. Rayquaza - Cannot learn Dragon Ascent in Sun Series and there are no Primals to really make it worth it. Can use Z Fly in Moon but meh Specs is probably better than that anyways. It has poor offensively potential and kinda bad defensive typing. It doesn't do as much as other restricteds and sometimes lowering the Spout damage is bad.
7. Reshiram - I just never pick it or seem to do well with it since too hard to control weather to support it and even if no Rain it still doesn't seem to accomplish much, Blue Flare also misses too much so use Fusion Flare
8. Palkia - All 4 of its moves got nerfed in power, also Spacial Rend nerfed with lowered crit chance, and Xern and other fairies counter it, plus more things outspeed it now
9. Zekrom - Outclassed by Koko, needs Fusion Flare

Nonrestricteds:

1.  Zapdos - Thunder is too inaccurate but is like its only good offensive move besides Heat Wave. Even if Tbolt it would be too weak. Also Lightningrod is an issue.
2. Murkrow - Low power, needs sash, more of a gimmicky support role with Rain Dance usually
3. Chansey - Once Knock Offed it is much easier to kill, also they can set up extra Geomancies or something on it, try Psychic/Misty Seed Blissey instead
4.
5. Weavile - Too fragile and too weak to Intimidate. Good with Scarf Ogre vs Lunala teams though.
8. Arcanine - Outclassed by Incineroar because no Fake Out and no Double Stab move which is somewhat needed in Rain.
9. Shiftry - Low power and Explosion was nerfed generations ago.
10. Milotic - If there is no Intimidate it doesn't do much and even if Intimidate it doesn't do much. Only ice and water moves.
11. Braviary - Doesn't really have a niche and even if Intimidated it doesn't do much.
12. Vivillion - Follow Me > Rage Powder, and Vivillion is usually outclassed by Smeargle or something.
13. Vikavolt - It is too slow and usually outclassed by Koko or something.
14. Malamar - Weak offensively and low stats overall
15. Latias - Light Clay Duel Screens, it does almost nothing offensively
16. Porygon2 - It doesn't seem to do anything well. Trick Room and bulk are its main redeeming qualities, but might as well use Cress or something if it is bad offensively.
17. Cress - It doesn't do anything offensively and does not support its allies as well as Bronzong does offensively or with Hypnosis. Cress seems only good if there is a lot of Groudon v. Kyogre wars for Skill Swap.
18. Whimsicott - Low damage and not very bulky.
19. Drifblim - Low damage and not a great movepool.
20. Sableye - Its niche is Gravity and a Blizzard or Pblades ally, both are worse in this format.
21. Naganadel - Too fragile and doesn't really counter anything or OHKO much.
22. Araquanid - Outclassed by Ogre and too many resistances to it. It does not have a diverse movepool either and sucks unless TR is up, and TR is rarely up.
23. Suicune - It has no niche and has poor offensive coverage and kinda bad defensive typing in some ways. Doesn't counter much.
24. Nihilego - Too fragile to really work well offensively. Outclassed by similar mons that are faster or better at what it tries to do.
25. Weavile - Fast and Powerful with Support moves, but dies too easily and doesn't do enough in Rain. Worse than Salazzle in my opinion since it doesn't have great resists.
26. Gothitelle - It doesn't do anything offensively and does not support its allies as well as Bronzong does offensively or with Hypnosis. Goth seems only good if there is a lot of Groudon v. Kyogre wars for Skill Swap. Shadow Tag isn't that useful since it is often used in back anyways.
27. Raichu-Alola - Too fragile to work and relies on Koko. No Z moves makes it bad.
28. Aegislash - It having to KS every other turn doesn't work in a fast-paced game and it doesn't work well in TR. It isn't that good by itself and supporting it isn't worth it.
29. Mimikyu - It does very little damage, vulnerable to taunt, and there are better TR users.
30. Moltres - It is outclassed by Talon or Tornadus nearly all the time.
31. Terrakion - Even with Whim support it isn't consistent, has bad defensive typing, but decent offense, however only a few OHKOs and is outsped by Kartana and etc.
32. Aromatisse - Offers nothing useful besides a reliable TR.
33. Mandibuzz - Weak to Xern and Koko and weak offensively.
34.  Bruxish - Anything weak to Ghost won't work as a TR setter vs Lunala. Weak offensively.
35. Cofagrigus - - Anything weak to Ghost won't work as a TR setter vs Lunala. Fake Tears won't be enough to work vs AV Yveltal Groudon teams.
36. Aero - Weak to Koko, needs Adamant to OHKO Incineroar. Low power in general.

Sample Teams (Not perfected yet, but close):

1. Mew2 Lele Abomasnow https://pokepast.es/e66614c72a144289
2. Palkia Toxicroak https://pokepast.es/14422b2152940857
3. Ho-Oh Groudon https://pokepast.es/ade1d90be15c6790
4. Dusk-Mane Kyogre https://pokepast.es/6bc90ef00231ac7f
5. Yveltal Ogre https://pokepast.es/efe46aa9c227dd50
More Sample Teams from an external site: https://victoryroad.es/equipos-muestra-vgc19-sun/

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